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[转贴] 每周外家搜集贴 -- 2008第19周

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发表于 2008-5-2 06:00 PM | 显示全部楼层 |阅读模式


发信人: chinook (Base Loaded), 信区: Stock
标 题: Re: C-帅的PUT怎么处理了
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Thu May 1 18:40:11 2008)

昨天+20%, 今天-50%,还捂着呢 - 要不怎么抓momo?今天就抓了一个日妹妹。

13000和2500是俺给这波反弹预期的顶,以后怎么玩还是看自己的trading time range
吧?

【 在 GoneAway (股市第一要诀:合理止损最重要) 的大作中提到: 】
: 能否给个方向,俺今天盘尾拿了些指数的PUT



-- [ 本帖最后由 xiaobailong 于 2008-5-2 19:13 编辑 ]
 楼主| 发表于 2008-5-3 02:52 AM | 显示全部楼层
Current Market View 2008-05-02 19:25:51
来源: 股帝08-05-02 19:29:08

All indices have hit their 200 MA and yet the bullish sentiment has been inching higher and higher everyday. Media is painting a very rosy picture for the economy. Do I trust this rally? Not at all. This bear rally is slowly turning into a suckers rally and it's very unwise to chase this rally at this stage. It's very rare for all indices to hit the 200 MA resistance without pulling back and I do not think this rally will be an exception.

While we should not be too persimistic about the economy, it would be very unwise to be blindly optimistic. From the earning reports of Mastercard and Visa, one would assume that the economy is doing very well. Why? The consumer credit card spending is up about 10% so far this year. However, looking deep down in the number, you will see that, American consumers are putting more and more their daily expenses onto their credit card loans. That implies that the consumers are very stretched out. To prove this fact, look no further than American Express. Unlike Mastercard and Visa, which are simply card issuers that charge transaction fees, American Express is a card issuer that also carries the credit card debts. American Express just announced that, they will add another 800 million dollars into their reserve to prepare for the credit default. That's an indication that the next round of financial crisis, the credit defaults is on the horizon. Consumer spending accounts for two third of the US economy and as long as the consumers are stretching out, the fuel for economy recovery will be lacking.

What the Fed has done so far has helped to stabilize the U.S. financial system and lower the immediate damage to the economy. However, the money that was injected by the Fed will not, as people expected, get back to the housing market or be used to pump up the consumer spending. Instead, it's very likely that, those money will be used to generate another bubble, most likely a commodity bubble. Unfortunately, a commodity bubble will be very counter productive to the US economy and in turn, will drag down the stock market.

Before there is strong evidence indicating that this is a soft landing, it's very important to preserve our capital. That does not mean that we should not follow the trend and trade stocks with the money that we can tolerate to lose. However, it's very important to not be blindsided by the rosy economy and market portraits painted by Wall Street.

By the way, a lot of people do not realize that, the Federal Reserve is not a Federal agency. Instead, it's a privately owned financial entity. I don't want to go into too much detail into it for now. However, it's very naive to trust everything being illustrated by the Fed and it's especially dangerous to count on the data from the Fed to make your investment decisions. Always remember, it's all a game.
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 楼主| 发表于 2008-5-3 01:24 PM | 显示全部楼层
coke about pot:

发信人: coke1 (coke), 信区: Stock
标 题: Re: Coke loaded pot already!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Fri May 2 23:36:27 2008)

huh? please don't scare me. Never go all in on anything.

I didn't go all in ya. 176.3 was about 20% from the high, I figured the
correction should be almost over under normal circumstance.I was prepared to
average down though.


However, if it occurred because of longer term sector rotation, that's a
different story.. Right now, I don't see evidence of that.

In fact, I would expect most of the old theme to resume probably as soon as
next week (although I would like to see more confirmation next week)


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 楼主| 发表于 2008-5-3 01:25 PM | 显示全部楼层
coke about DRYS

发信人: coke1 (coke), 信区: Stock
标 题: Re: Coke loaded pot already!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Fri May 2 23:47:43 2008)

still $100 as the first target


【 在 stockhero (stockloser) 的大作中提到: 】
: thanks coke.
: What do you mean by old theme to resume? All indices down while commodity
up
: ? How do you think of DRYS at this moment?



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 楼主| 发表于 2008-5-3 01:25 PM | 显示全部楼层
coke about DRYS:


发信人: coke1 (coke), 信区: Stock
标 题: Re: Coke loaded pot already!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Sat May 3 12:15:50 2008)

You can tell that it does look like $100 can be reached quite easily in a
couple of weeks.

However, that is true only if the market sentiment overall remains positive
through the next couple of weeks and no severe sector rotation out of
commodity-related stocks.




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 楼主| 发表于 2008-5-3 01:26 PM | 显示全部楼层
coke about DRYS:

发信人: coke1 (coke), 信区: Stock
标 题: Re: Coke loaded pot already!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Sat May 3 13:11:30 2008)

oh? sorry. too many pms. and sometimes, the pms don't show up until months
later (I think it's because they came in when the mailbox was full)

Anyway, for dryshipping discussions, www.trader1688.com has had at least 3
long threads that have gone over many details about it since about march
last year. Almost everything you need to know about dry shipping is there.

you can search for "shipping" ,"干船",or something like "船越来越多"
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 楼主| 发表于 2008-5-3 01:29 PM | 显示全部楼层
psp about FSLR:

发信人: psp (I love psp), 信区: Stock
标 题: Re: long fslr
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Thu May 1 17:44:51 2008)

xi,xi, you are wrong, that long is DT only, my call was out @13.7, and
bought may 260 put 11.1, FSLR has no support before 200
【 在 silkroad77 (丝路) 的大作中提到: 】
: 吓得我赶快把fslr的short给出了。赚了几顿buffet,也算不错了.



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 楼主| 发表于 2008-5-4 03:04 PM | 显示全部楼层
 Post subject: 美国未来最强最弱板块探讨
PostPosted: 5/4/08 11:56 
Offline 模拟帐户

Joined: 8/23/06 20:27
Posts: 4914
炒股炒到一定时候发现眼光是很重要的,我是没啥眼光的,要不然已经赚得几麻袋都装不下了,但我还是愿意写出我的看法,目的是希望引点HH们的玉出来.
记不清是哪位高手说的,未来几年科技股会比较强,我觉得很有道理,美国这方面的人才优势还是很明显的,短期不会变.
我以为金融地产还会弱几年. 美元在国际市场的地位已经下降很多,但还会降.美元最风光时占全球资本市场份额太大,要降到一定程度才能企稳(比如跟欧元同等),加上美国自己不挣气,又 弄出个次贷来,再跟房地产之间产生点连锁反应,以前的资本市场也面临被一些新兴国家分去一杯羹的危险,金融地产几年内都不能乐观. 有的东西就这样,一旦进入恶性循环,就很难转变. 
我其实也是美元贬值的受害者,至今手里仍有不少美元,所幸是没投资美国房产,要不然美元地产一齐贬,太亏了.

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 楼主| 发表于 2008-5-4 03:59 PM | 显示全部楼层
热钱的下一个目标:食品和石油
来源: kxfzg11108-05-04 13:36:20

其实金融机构的危机很好解决,只要美联储多印钞票,降低利率,多给银行一些钱,就可以堵住漏洞,甚至可以秘密给银行资金运转。

但是这些钱如何使用,并且增值就是一个难题。

高科技股票和楼市曾经是热钱集中的地方。但是房价在2010年才可能见底。

对普通消费者来说,房子比科技重要,食品比房子重要。

投资人就是要投入人们离不开的东西进行投资才能获利。

所以,现在2008年是投资食品的好机会,等2009年再进入楼市抄底。

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 楼主| 发表于 2008-5-4 04:00 PM | 显示全部楼层
YHOO的Fair Market Value和YHOO,GOOG,MSFT今后的股价
来源: goldman08-05-04 08:43:36

在MSFT提出收购YHOO前,它$20左右的股价基本反映了当时的Fair Market Value。有人觉得MSFT出到31,所以YHOO该值31是不对的。因为任何大宗收购都必须附很高的Premium。看看默老头收购DJ付了多少 Premium就知道了。被收购的公司越是不想卖,Premium付得越多。客观地讲,MSFT在和GOOG的对抗中烧钱已经到了不理性的地步。 Facebook作价15B就说明MSFT非常Desperate。从YHOO和GOOG的P/E看,YHOO的forwardP/E一直比GOOG高 50%到120%,因此它已经被Over Valued 而不是Yang自己讲的Under Valued。大千的人都知道$30的股票不一定比$600的更便宜。关键要看盈利能力。凭良心将,YHOO的盈利能力真比GOOG差远了。
但是现在,YHOO到跌不下$20。因为Yang有backup。他会宣布和Google的合作。谁都知道如果YHOO彻底放弃自己花了无数银子打造的乌 七八糟的Search Engine和广告系统而转用GOOG的,它的盈利将提升70%。因此它的Fair Market Value应该是每股$20*1.7 ~ $34。这也是它不愿意33被卖的原因。当然,为了讨好WS,YHOO必须裁掉它那些二流的工程师和PM。当然,这有待时日,毕竟不如MSFT的块钱快。 作为GOOG,只有YHOO甘当老二,会善待后者,共同对抗MSFT。GOOG的盈利将稳定增长。
对MSFT来讲,如果放弃了internet的梦想,对投资者来讲事件好事,它可以更加盈利。对WS来讲,必须有一些软件公司,也必须有一些Internet公司,MSFT是前者的最佳人选,YHOO和GOOG是后者的人选。如果大家和平相处,利润多多,谁都高兴。
总结一下,YHOO会跌,但不会跌回二月份的$20。GOOG长期看好。MSFT看它自己,如果仍然一意孤行要进internet市场,将拖累盈利;如果放弃internet,长期看好。
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 楼主| 发表于 2008-5-4 04:00 PM | 显示全部楼层
MSFT really needs YHOO......
来源: stocknh08-05-04 09:16:18

回答: YHOO的Fair Market Value和YHOO,GOOG,MSFT今后的股价goldman2008-05-04 08:43:36

"MSFT看它自己,如果仍然一意孤行要进internet市场,将拖累盈利;如果放弃internet,长期看好。"

You are wrong. if MSFT gives up internet market, eventually it will be killed by GOOG.

Both Ballmer and Gates are smarter than us. They really have good long-term sense. Otherwise, they would not kill Netscape long time ago.

Did you remember a concept called Net PC from oracle? That would be a disaster for MSFT, if it was successfully launched. Fortunately, due to bandwidth and other resource limitations, the project failed. But it does not mean GOOG will not do the same thing again.

The reason MSFT wants to buy YHOO is to have chance to compete with GOOG, once Net PC concept comes back.
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 楼主| 发表于 2008-5-4 04:01 PM | 显示全部楼层
回复:MSFT really needs YHOO......
来源: Goldman08-05-04 09:27:29

回答: MSFT really needs YHOO......stocknh2008-05-04 09:16:18

历史上从来没有老二加老三能胜过老大的合并。MSFT+YHOO属于1+1<2的那种合并。所以WS更本不看好MSFT+YHOO。在 internet上,MSFT砸锅卖铁去上吊也斗不过GOOG。如果你和GOOG的两个Founders谈过就知道了。作为WS,不关心谁是 internet的老大,赚钱是硬道理。谁要破坏了这个硬道理,谁就完蛋。如果明天有一个比GOOG还能赚钱的公司(但肯定不是MSFT),它照样抛弃 GOOG去捧它。
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 楼主| 发表于 2008-5-4 04:02 PM | 显示全部楼层
华尔街捧GOOG和APPL得原因
来源: 南风劲08-05-04 10:25:22

回答: YHOO的Fair Market Value和YHOO,GOOG,MSFT今后的股价goldman2008-05-04 08:43:36

是因为GOOG的方向是NET PC.而AAPL的方向是Portal PC. 这是未来IT的两个方向。而目前看来这两个方向都没有MSFT得戏。这是为什么MSFT着急的根本原因。GOOG的NET PC 会扔掉销售靠OS盈利的模式。MSFT是靠OS捆绑销售盈利的。
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 楼主| 发表于 2008-5-4 04:04 PM | 显示全部楼层
Investor don't want to buy fair value stock.
来源: randomeSell08-05-04 13:43:53

回答: YHOO的Fair Market Value和YHOO,GOOG,MSFT今后的股价goldman2008-05-04 08:43:36

They want to buy sth. at least 20% below fair value stock, especially when it is ride down. So I think Yhoo will be around 20 before bargain hunter kicking in. And previous Yhoo stock value has reflected the options Yahoo have(like use google's tech). so when It really happens, it won't be the 70% percent difference like you mentioned. it will be more like 40%. so 20 * 1.4 = 28 is about the fair value when you think about it because after that yahoo is no longer a game player any more. which will be discounted.
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 楼主| 发表于 2008-5-4 04:07 PM | 显示全部楼层
回复:YHOO的Fair Market Value和YHOO,GOOG,MSFT今后的股价
来源: test2test08-05-04 13:50:49

回答: YHOO的Fair Market Value和YHOO,GOOG,MSFT今后的股价goldman2008-05-04 08:43:36

hehe. you know nothing about finance and on-line/search biz.

1. yahoo valued 31. if you get rid of current china/japan value which is about 11~14. yahoo is valued at 17~20. the real p/e is about 20+ actually.
that is a steal for msft both finacially and strategically.

2. search is different from search monetization.
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 楼主| 发表于 2008-5-5 07:21 AM | 显示全部楼层
发信人: eric717 (eric), 信区: Stock
标 题: Intermediate-term Rollover of the Market
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Mon May 5 00:06:20 2008)

S&P over 1400, DJIA finally closed over 13,000. Nasdaq is leading the way.

VIX fell to 18, a rising bank index, the SOX over 400. GOOG now the datling
and POT the loser. Market looks very bullish recently.

What concerns me here is low equity put/call ratio with the reading of 58%,
which is lower than 59% reading of April 18. Following 59% reading, S&P
loses 15 points in two days. All other readings lower than 58% early this
year and late last year all happen to be relative high of the market.This
means market may show too mcuh enthusiasm. A market correction will happen
in early May as I expressed last week.

With the Fed out of the way, major earning reports over and no big economic
reports on the horizon, the market is looking for catalysts to drive the
next move. Seasonally, things begin to weaken at this point.

But I don't think we will have persistent downturn and it may just be a
correction. One reason is that the market's recent strength has bolstered
sentiment and is causing plenty of worry about being underinvested.
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 楼主| 发表于 2008-5-5 07:22 AM | 显示全部楼层
发信人: eric717 (eric), 信区: Stock
标 题: Re: Intermediate-term Rollover of the Market
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Mon May 5 00:41:51 2008)

One reason I still hold long term bullish view is that the worst in credit
market may be over. Goldman already closed all their mortgage paper short
positions. Hedge funds that still bet on credit default may end it up
providing upside support for the market.
--
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 楼主| 发表于 2008-5-5 07:22 AM | 显示全部楼层
发信人: ibeyond (hello), 信区: Stock
标 题: Re: Intermediate-term Rollover of the Market
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Mon May 5 00:47:32 2008)

I still believe long term bearish until we see commodities go down hill.
Worst Credit crunch might be temporarily over. However, market has not
priced in inflation yet...

【 在 eric717 (eric) 的大作中提到: 】
: One reason I still hold long term bullish view is that the worst in credit
: market may be over. Goldman already closed all their mortgage paper short
: positions. Hedge funds that still bet on credit default may end it up
: providing upside support for the market.


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 楼主| 发表于 2008-5-5 07:23 AM | 显示全部楼层
发信人: eric717 (eric), 信区: Stock
标 题: Re: Intermediate-term Rollover of the Market
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Mon May 5 00:57:27 2008)

Recent market downturn in first three mont of the year was primarily due to
the concern of breakdown of financial system and credit market not high
commodity price. The impact of commodity price on economy is not a one-way
train. When commodity price runs up too high and slows down the economy, it
will affect the demand on commodities and correct their price.
--
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发表于 2008-5-5 11:39 AM | 显示全部楼层
发信人: chinook (Base Loaded), 信区: Stock
标 题: 灌瓢水
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Mon May 5 12:21:16 2008)

其实也没什么好说的,估计市场将如同俺这个人一样boring。但thread已经开了,总要
添点东西。

job report出奇的好,让大家多少对市场有了点信心,所以尽管回调是应该的,但估计
幅度不回太大。探探2400估计就差不多了。 另一方面,也没什么力量或消息让大盘继
续加速前进,所以估计大家都像无头的苍蝇,上一天,下一天般的晃荡。指数的swing
估计不太好玩。

不好的方面,也许我们会看到基于valuation concern的领头股downgrade,比如AAPL或
AMZN。CSCO的ER俺看boring(beat 1c again?),市场反映稍微negative。

好的方面,house number也许比预期好。

总而言之,这周看sluggish,NAZ下个四,五十点吧。

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